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Post by rexbannon on Aug 25, 2014 6:31:07 GMT -8
So I noticed something this weekend as i was doing research for a one day adventure im making for the epoch. Well reading up on the relic/scrap vehicles i noticed that the scrap armored car has a movement of 16/35 with a fully loaded fuel tank of 60L. The one thing that isnt clear is how exactly fuel is consumed? If the armored car has a 60L tank and can move 16/35 how many miles can it travel before running out of gas? I did some quick research on this subject and found that world war two german armored cars could get about 10 miles per gallon. there is 4L in a gallon, 60L divided by 4L = 15 x 10 miles = 150 miles per full tank. I guess my question is how do we determine the full economy for each type of vehicle? How much does one gallon of fuel cost? in the pitford book there is pricing for bio fuel which is great but what about conventional gasoline?
I would like for there to be a complete table that breaks this down for the player so that we can all quick reference it and not have to do research and math in order to figure it out. Let alone if the vehicle is modified by a player with a high rank in mechanics! how would that effect the vehicle after he tweeks it? |
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Post by providence13 on Aug 25, 2014 8:34:25 GMT -8
Good questions. I wonder how much petroleum will be left in ME? Some GM's might want a 'society is running out of everything' type of world but I think ME is a 'world is getting back on its feet with an attitude' game. Fuel for travel is a hodge podge of systems for my games; I could see some bio-diesel, sure. Maybe a good bit of synthetics from Bio/Chem techs too. Fuel cells that run on H2, seawater, urine, acid blood, whatever.. Another small community might use pig or chicken crap methane, or even compressed air. zeropollutionmotors.us/Heck, a horse mill could run the air pump. I'll always have a bit of nostalgia for TW:2000 alcohol stills.  My group has even found a thorium powered air car. The real genie out of the bottle though is power cells, in my opinion. Way I see it, a mini power cell is about the same as our best electric vehicle battery today. A power clip would make EV that much more attractive and if you've got a power pack.. you're set. All this doesn't answer your questions though. With high and low tech sharing the same zip code, some engines could be flexible; able to run on 2-3 different systems. Every town price commodities according to their needs and ability to produce. I like the fact that everything in the book has a random element to pricing. I think they should also have a random element to mileage. |
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Post by Mutant Lord: William McAusland on Aug 25, 2014 8:52:00 GMT -8
Yeah, I'm going with the flex-fuel system, especially from scrap built vehicles as the builders would never be sure where they could get energy from next, especially on a long expedition. Alcohol fuel is the main gasoline type substance in the Epoch, although relic cars would be able to run on either as in the end days, fuel shortages forced drivers to fill up with whatever was available at the pump.
A gas mileage table would be great,though, Rexbannon. You seem to have a great insight into this already. Do you think you can be drafted into crafting such a table?
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Post by rexbannon on Aug 25, 2014 10:02:23 GMT -8
I have no problem with that WA! Ill draft one up as soon as i can get the research done. I'll have to look up different types of vehicles and there fuel economy rates to get an idea how far they could possibly go on a full tank. Also ill add a section on upgrading the different types of vehicles based on rank ability in mechanics. It'll be a set list of possible modifications that can be made to all types of vehicles similar to the way the junk crafter can make certain things based off of rank. One other thing though is speed? i tried to figure it out myself but it was difficult to do. 16M divided by a 5 second round = 3.2 meters per second, which equals roughly about 6 mph. 35M divided by a 5 second round = 15.6 meters per second, which equals roughly about 15 mph. the average semi-truck can go from 0-60 in about 5 minutes. this equals 300 seconds to reach a speed of 60 mph divide that 300 seconds by 4 rounds to get the 15mph per every 5 seconds which doesnt add up. really it would take 300 seconds to reach a top speed of 42mph. 300 seconds divided by the 7 meters per second equals 42 mph in five minutes. it would be closer to 8 minutes to go from 0-60 which would be equal to about 57mph in actuality. this is going to be a lot of math but ill knock it out so that others dont have too, plus add in some goodies like i said. and thats just one scrap vehicle to boot!
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Post by Mutant Lord: William McAusland on Aug 25, 2014 12:34:16 GMT -8
OMG, math for sure! Seems the further I get from High School the weaker my Math gets. Glad you are tackling this and not me! Whatever you can do to make the table or rules quick to access at the game table will be much appreciated. I can convert it into a PDF after and make it an SOE downloadable goodie.
Thanks!
Will
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Post by rexbannon on Aug 25, 2014 17:58:05 GMT -8
This is what I've come up with so far! ill come up with the list of mechanic upgrades that effect this chart tomorrow.  |
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Post by Mutant Lord: William McAusland on Aug 25, 2014 20:54:58 GMT -8
That's simply wicked! Nice work sire!
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Post by rexbannon on Aug 26, 2014 2:12:46 GMT -8
So im wondering what effect high speeds will have on ram damage? Im guessing the ram damage in the book is for the speeds set in the book already, which are combat speeds. But at sixty miles an hour its gotta do more damage?
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Post by providence13 on Aug 26, 2014 5:06:30 GMT -8
16M divided by a 5 second round = 3.2 meters per second, which equals roughly about 6 mph. 35M divided by a 5 second round = 15.6 meters per second, which equals roughly about 15 mph. the average semi-truck can go from 0-60 in about 5 minutes. this equals 300 seconds to reach a speed of 60 mph divide that 300 seconds by 4 rounds to get the 15mph per every 5 seconds which doesnt add up. really it would take 300 seconds to reach a top speed of 42mph. Hey man. This is a great idea, glad you are on it. ME has 3 sec combat rnds which might change your numbers a bit. 16/3=5.33 Not a big deal, but might throw off the bigger numbers down the road. Instead of exact acc/dec values, how about 1/4, 1/2, full speed or 1/3's or whatever. Traveling with a load of cargo put's you up to the next bracket for acc/dec. Like you said, it takes longer to get up to cruising speed from 0 vs cruise to max, it might not divide exactly, just an average for most vehicles. Just a thought. |
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Post by rexbannon on Aug 26, 2014 5:42:27 GMT -8
Thanks Prov13 for the input! Its touch a go right now. I thought ME had 5 sec rounds oops! But the way i see it, it still works out. As long as its close and we have some way of determining speed then ill be happy. I like the 1/4, 1/2, or 1/3 speed values. ill try to figure that one out tonight and ill have the RAW movement values as tactical speed. Im trying to do this so that high speed battles along the highways are more cinematic and accurate. Also it would be nice to know how far a vehicle can go on a full tank. When done i hope that battle scenes like the ones in mad max will be doable with little effort or thinking for the PC and GM. well at least in theory anyways. still have a bunch of math to crunch and tables to design in order for this to work. the revise it a bit after play testing it.
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Post by providence13 on Aug 26, 2014 6:38:29 GMT -8
Maybe vehicle hits vs people go straight into crits. Or multiple crits.. 1 crit with first speed 2 crits with next speed "bracket" 4 crits.. 8 crits.. Unless you make an increasingly difficult HC to bring it down to the next lower level. IDK. |
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Post by providence13 on Aug 26, 2014 6:42:29 GMT -8
Or use the falling chart!
Already existing rules..
Edit:
Well, yeah, pg 223 does already have vehicle ram damage, but maybe it should be more (x2?) for full speed.
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Post by rexbannon on Aug 26, 2014 11:11:10 GMT -8
Both great ideas Prov13! I like the idea of the falling damage. it could be tweeked to represent the weight of the vehicle that hits you. mixed with the brackets which could reprsent the speed and or the height fallen from coupled with the weight of the car that hits you. An of course you would get a HC check to avoid being hit. The faster the Vehicle is going the harder the HC is to avoid being hit.
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Post by rexbannon on Aug 28, 2014 6:49:35 GMT -8
One thing i noticed after making the chart was that scrap vehicles overall have slightly better movement on rough terrain. An most of the relic cars have the the same all around speed well on rough terrain. I think in order to convert this chart i made to incorporate the 1/4, 1/2, full speed values into it ill have to average out the two values for each type of vehicle. be it scrap or relic and the split it into the three different speed values. Ram damage i think should stay the same for tactical and 1/4 speed. But as for 1/2 and full speed there should be modifications the the damage, as Prov13 suggested. i will have time this weekend to put the chart together completed and work o n my one day adventure story plots some more. Im also planning on finishing my newest NPC's Purist army Captain Zanzibar and Purist General Cornwallace!
As a bit of a teaser General Cornwallace is in charge of the southern Defense force in my campaign. he is much like Rommel the Desert fox only more highly decorated and relentless. His primier force is Wally's Wasps, a highly trained task force consisting of ANZAC style recon specialits.
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Post by rexbannon on Aug 28, 2014 8:16:17 GMT -8
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