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Post by ecocola on Mar 21, 2014 17:54:59 GMT -8
Well i currently have a problem player, he nearly died to five chainsaw wielding skullocks in a gladiator type fight. His character took a ton of damage, but lived through it and killed them all. Then he literally scrapped that character (having already done it to 3 characters before) and I just learned the reason. Apparently he can't take it if he creates a character with characterization if they can die on an encounter in the wastes. He believes skullocks and the like are just XP baskets and shouldn't be able to kill a PC He also says the dice roller in my game (this is PbP) is completely bullcrap and it always gives him 70's and 80's. I tried to argue that you can still create a lively character and have mortality in a game, but he disagrees and now just wants to play flat characters calling my game, "hack and slash stat game" I'm about 5 minutes away from just kicking him out of my game, but that would mean postponing the adventure for the third time.
I've found out how to fix this, but i still want to hear about how people feel on the topic.
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Post by providence13 on Mar 22, 2014 6:23:21 GMT -8
Kick him out. It's your game. Are there other players? Will they thank you for it? Has any other player died? Do all of his characters take crazy risks and put themselves in stupid situations? Just being a neutral opinion, but is there any veracity to his claim? Not trying to be antagonistic. I know how it is with me sometimes. I have to stop and ask the hard question, "Are they right?" Although it is fun to roll up characters, I like to play them a bit longer, myself. It's amazing how much TME characters change in just a few Ranks. (HR: I'm beginning to think WE skills should have a cap or maybe 2:1 after 10 points..) TME is a lethal game! If you play smart, you still might die. Maybe he's seen Mazes and Monsters one too many times.. I've asked players in other game to give me a list of things that would make the game more fun for them. Not a list of special magic/relic items, but things like "more role-play, less role-play, more combat, less combat, more character/world backstory, jumping right into an environment and figuring it out as you go.." I can't meet everyone's needs all the time, but I try to give them all a purpose for showing up to the game. If a PC has the Negotiate skill, give them plenty of opportunities to use it. (Some cultures like haggling, some do not.) Funny that with other "high roll" rpgs, 70-80'S would be awesome. His problem there might be perspective. I don't like the PC's to know what encounters are random. We use them, sometimes, I just try to describe it as intently as I would any other encounter. I just give them less time to react. I don't have any experience with online gaming. My old play by post game days involved a BBS <TRADE WARS!> How does it work? Can you just kick him out? Does the game have to just stop or can you kick him out mid-game and keep going? "Bob has been complaining about chest pains; again. Gathering wood for a fire, while grumbling something about a princess and a pea, he falls over dead."
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Post by ecocola on Mar 22, 2014 10:54:38 GMT -8
Basically i appeased him by allowing a character he liked to stay behind and build some sort of excavator business. I prefer to play a lethal game, where a skullock can kill you because if a monster/humanoid isn't supposed to kill you, why add it to the game? But i'm not gonna sit around and devise methods to intentionally kill the players, i think the game does it fine by itself.
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Post by providence13 on Mar 22, 2014 20:35:11 GMT -8
But i'm not gonna sit around and devise methods to intentionally kill the players, i think the game does it fine by itself. Oh, it's a talent. These things just come to me; and I have great players. Glad you found an equitable solution.
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Post by ecocola on Mar 22, 2014 23:07:11 GMT -8
But i'm not gonna sit around and devise methods to intentionally kill the players, i think the game does it fine by itself. Oh, it's a talent. These things just come to me; and I have great players. Glad you found an equitable solution. I would love to come up with them, but as previously mentioned one would just roll 8 times in the future and say "Oh i missed, oh i missed, oh i missed, oh i missed, there i finally hit, F*** it i'm dead!"
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Post by providence13 on Mar 23, 2014 8:36:03 GMT -8
Basically i appeased him by allowing a character he liked to stay behind and build some sort of excavator business. I like this idea. My players have started running mail, have a broccoli bush and corn tree farm in Walsave and might invest in a brothel. For these guys, it helps them feel like they are really being a part of their world. Also, running mail is a good cover for Freehold Scout recon. Being a Scout might get you a free bed and reduced rates on supplies, but there's some info that only comes from people who don't talk to "the cops".
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Post by ecocola on Mar 23, 2014 9:13:56 GMT -8
Yeah i actually like it too. We already have a long range game plan: A big fort!
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Post by rexbannon on Mar 24, 2014 4:37:25 GMT -8
"TME is a lethal game! If you play smart, you still might die. Maybe he's seen Mazes and Monsters one too many times.."
This had me rolling! All i can say Ecocola is that if you have a problem player that keeps causing problems sometimes kicking him out of the game is the best option. That being said, if you keep him around instead and he keeps crapping on your version of the Epoch game world then that just means that it needs to become more of a challenge for him. I would limit him to a handful of character types that require more attention to detail in order to stay alive. My players call this type of character "squishy" ! give him only squishy characters and make him earn his keep the hard way.
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Post by providence13 on Mar 24, 2014 5:38:52 GMT -8
Yeah i actually like it too. We already have a long range game plan: A big fort! Glad it worked out for everyone. As a GM, I never want to lose players. I have had a few that I didn't mind if they show'd or not. Not everyone participates the same, or at all. I did learn the hard way that just one person can be allowed to spoil the game. It sounds like you found a solution working together and that's why we play. rex, Tom Hanks in that movie caused more problems than any other in my adolescent gaming days. In truth it was drugs the character was taking that led to his fall. You remember how E.T. started? The kids were playing D&D and Eliot wanted to play a goblin! But no one ever mentions that D&D was featured in a positive popular movie that everyone loved. They only remember the one that "threatens our kids".. To this day I don't talk about gaming to non-gamers.
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Post by ecocola on Mar 24, 2014 8:08:05 GMT -8
"TME is a lethal game! If you play smart, you still might die. Maybe he's seen Mazes and Monsters one too many times.." This had me rolling! All i can say Ecocola is that if you have a problem player that keeps causing problems sometimes kicking him out of the game is the best option. That being said, if you keep him around instead and he keeps crapping on your version of the Epoch game world then that just means that it needs to become more of a challenge for him. I would limit him to a handful of character types that require more attention to detail in order to stay alive. My players call this type of character "squishy" ! give him only squishy characters and make him earn his keep the hard way. He actually did roll up a comfort clone, but God forbid she go on a dig, all the characters on the current dig are super combat characters. All with 30+dv (one have 50dv and as force shield and force field) at rank one and two (my fault, I accidentally used the wrong prices for items made them too cheap) the only real character that isn't super combat is mine, heavy leather a Longsword and a bow, a shotgun with 3 rounds.
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Post by omegabase on Apr 1, 2014 13:43:15 GMT -8
What a great topic! I think this question comes up in all RPG's where your characters can permanently croak. Which is most of them. When playing rather than GMing, I personally favor a high-danger/high-mortality game. So I love the TME base rules and modules. But in my experience this outlook from players is kind of unusual. Most players in any game I've GM'd just don't like to die, some to extremes, as in ecocola's great example. This is understandable to some extent, as you've put a lot of time into the character and hate to see him/her go down. The cost of PC death cuts both ways, as the GM may have also put a lot of effort into developing the characters backstory, with extensive 'interlude' essays, in-game role-playing, and whatnot. But as any GM will tell you, without actual risk, a lot of the fun and challenge goes out of the game. On the other hand, there are systems where character development is everything, and that's what the players are in it for. Despite the rarity or complete lack of permanent death, these games have a great following and do sustain themselves over many years. A radical example would be the Eclipse Phase system. Highly unlikely your 'ego' will be permanently destroyed, but still a rewarding game. Admittedly, EP is more of a big-picture 'high-concept' sci-fi rpg, not down in the dirt like TME and GW style postapoc games. In my postapoc campaign I try to achieve a balance between character building and mortality risk. Also at the start I devised a sort of 'safety valve' for the inevitable PC death(s): let the players know that when building a replacement character, they can transfer half their dead character's prior rank (rounding up) to the new character. This lessens the pain somewhat. Also it's needed in order to keep the campaign moving, since rank 1 PCs would not be able to keep up and lack critical skills the party absolutely depends on by that point. By random chance, one of the PCs in my campaign rolled a mental mutation that can randomly teleport him away from a single killing stroke, one time per 12 hours. So he's able to sponge deaths and take crazy risks for the party (he has 'died' 3 times by my count so far). Otherwise multiple PCs would have probably died already. But things are getting pretty hairy and some PCs might croak soon.
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Post by rexbannon on Apr 4, 2014 13:37:05 GMT -8
If they do croak soon omegabase make sure to add there story to the wall of remembrance here on the forum so that their sacrifices and adventures will forever be a part of the TME community!
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Post by ecocola on Apr 4, 2014 14:29:53 GMT -8
If they do croak soon omegabase make sure to add there story to the wall of remembrance here on the forum so that their sacrifices and adventures will forever be a part of the TME community! I plan on doing it two fold: their names on the Digger's Memorial in Pitford and submitted to the dead wall.
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Post by ecocola on Apr 16, 2014 0:16:52 GMT -8
Alright i have a new problem now, the player really does NOT want to play a combat class draftee or militia. His way of seeing it, "If i'm not a merc or infantry or above, then i don't want to play it." Yet i see nothing wrong with playing draftee or militia. hell, i'd WANT to play a draftee if i could. the RP perspective for me would be amazing, a kid forced to fight in a war he didn't want to participate? yes please.
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Post by rexbannon on Apr 16, 2014 3:08:09 GMT -8
If this is the same player as before then he sounds like a pre-madonna! I dont want to hate on anyones players but this guy is even making me angry and i dont know him or play with him at all. Is he below the age of thirteen? If not i would tell him to act his age and not his shoe size an just take the character that he is given. If he doesnt like the character he rolled up then he can take a hike because thats roll playing. Its not always the character you want to play. There is some pride in takeing a character that is weak and or pathetic from the start and roleplaying them smartly into an amazing character down the road. That you alone built up, its an accomplishment.
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