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Post by maxstone on Oct 5, 2013 19:33:46 GMT -8
I'd like to propose a new class of weapons, both for the love of sci-fi classic armaments and to add strategic options to the gameplay. Version one: quite standard weapons, emphasis on using them against robots / androids / cyborgs. Version two: strong but very short ranged and slow weapons. PLASMA WEAPONS version 1
These weapons are very rare and technologically advanced and were manufactured after the fall mainly by pure stock human armies. The main advantage of this kind of weapons is the high efficiency against robotic enemies and heavily armored targets such as the ones of the Mecha faction. Targets are hit by pulses of super heated, ionized matter which melts almost every kind of material and easily damages electronic circuits. Due to the nature of the projectiles fired, these weapons are somewhat sort ranged. Also their usefulness against biological enemies, such as humans or skullocks, is questionable. When tested against organic infantry, plasma often left crippled, half burn targets still alive on the battlefield, giving them the opportunity to strike back. To effectively eliminate these kind of targets a precise shot to the head or upper torso is required-Therefore, for this purpose, bullet and laser weapons are far superior. When using these devices against humans, the "Table TME--7 Random Body Location" page 106 must be used to determine the DAMAGE output. A shot to arms, legs or lower torso results in half the damage rolled. -Shots can set on fire hairs, clothes or other flammable materials 60% of the times When using these devices against mechanical units the user gets +25 SV bonus plus a +10 DAMAGE bonus. Cyborgs fall in this category for the SV bonus, but still require the table TME n 7 to determine the DMG. Finally, critical hits occur 4% of the times (instead of 1%) and result in the melting of the object hit. This can render armors or guns useless or instantly kill enemies. GMs must be creative here ( plus it's fun as hell melting things with plasma , right??  ) PLASMA PISTOL
Anti robot side gun. Solid and deadly at close range. Found with a foldable side display that highlights and identifies mechanical enemies up to 50m (15% of the times).Runs with pill power cell, 2 years. SV: +5 Rate: 1 DMG: d20 Range: 50m Hands: 1 STR: 15 ammo: power cell/20 shots Weight: 1.5 kg Value: 1500+d1000 sp PLASMA SHOTGUN
The nightmare of androids and cyborgs. One shot or two of this beast will melt even the toughest bot. SV: +20 Rate: 1 DMG: 4d10+10 Range: 25m Hands: 2 STR: 30 ammo: power cell/10 shots Weight: 6,5 kg Value: 2500+d1000 sp PLASMA RIFLE
Most versatile anti robot weapon. Meant to be used on single shot more than burst fire because of the high energy drain. Found with special scope that highlights and identifies mechanical enemies up to 200m (15% of the times).Runs with mini power cell, 2 years. SV: +12 Rate: 1 or 3 DMG: d20+5 Range: 200m Hands: 2 STR: 28 ammo: power cell/10 shots Weight: 6 kg Value: 2500+d1000 sp PLASMA SMG
Prototype weapon, never used on the battlefield due to the high demand of power and the short range. Very few of these were built. When firing full auto or 3 rounds burst, if a 100 is rolled, the weapons melts in the hand of the user inflicting him half the damage of the attack. SV: +5 Rate: 1 , 3 or 5 DMG: d20 Range: 120m Hands: 1 STR: 20 ammo: power cell/15 shots Weight: 3 kg Value: 1000+d1000 sp |
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Post by providence13 on Oct 5, 2013 20:19:56 GMT -8
Maxstone, these are great ideas! I've thought of adding plasma weapons to high tech orbital installations. In MegaTraveller, (and Traveller The New Era) there was plasma splash damage, if you were close to the impact. A chemical laser heated hydrogen pellets to near fusion in a magnetic bottle.. Traveller 2300AD also had pretty good plasma weapons.
I love the idea of over-heating your weapons. Hearkens back to Mechwarrior!
Edit: We also need to add neutral particle beam weapons! They'll need something for the particle beam mass.. These would absolutely fry electronics while still doing serious damage.
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Post by maxstone on Oct 6, 2013 3:44:14 GMT -8
Thanks Providence13  , I'm going to play test these some of these weapons next week and then I'll report the results. Do you think the halved damage to organic beings(arms, legs ) is too big as a drawback? That can be a good way to "promote" called shots. I'd love to see particle beam weapons too! What do you think would be their main strength? Huge DMG output like laser cannons or some other particular feature? |
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clockpunk
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Post by clockpunk on Oct 6, 2013 8:37:55 GMT -8
Double-thumbsup. Plasma weapons were next on my 'to do' list, and these seem to be a great adaptation. I do like the need for tactical (called shot) consideration - very VATS-like.
Funnily enough I was also thinking of beam weapons - with a greater level of accuracy afforded over rounds in which the weapon was run, in that the wielder can clearly see where the on-going shot was... I don't know if that might be worth considering...?
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Post by providence13 on Oct 6, 2013 10:16:33 GMT -8
Awesome. My players would love those. I can't wait to hear how your new weapons play out.The following is just my take on the concepts. My post is based on bad physics further gunked up with years of sci-fi gaming and books, movies and even radio(!) written more for drama than a firm grasp of reality. Plasma weapons (and Particle beams) will behave differently than slug throwers and lasers in the game. Without getting too deep, the laser weapons in TME just need energy. Power them up and they go! "Targets are hit by pulses of super heated, ionized matter" Just like you stated, we need something, an additional type of ammo, for the matter. So we still need power cells and packs but we'll need something like "bullets" too. At least in the early stages of tech, the ROF is going to be a bit slower than other weapons. I think of it more like a bow or crossbow. Probably firing once every other 3 sec round (at best). That's up to each GM, as always. A laser hits a chunk of something (hydrogen fuel pellet encased in artificial carbon/diamond/black jello.. I don't know), super heats it and (something else*) flings it out of the barrel. You could just open the barrel and let it spray, like a garden hose, but that jet of fire might also rocket the gun back and the range would kind of suck; cooling as soon as it leaves the barrel, the molten gas stuff would expand and lose most of its punch before it hits the target. Some people believe the same laser that heats the ammo can also pre-hit the target, as it were, so the plasma can ride the laser, staying super hot the whole way. To make it functional on the battlefield, this would all have to happen in at least the same time it takes to load and fire an RPG or drop a mortar. Probably do the same damage too! Another alternative is to assume some "stuff" is in regular power cells that can be used as the matter. It's definitely not a lithium ion battery like we have today. This way, you'd only need one type of ammo, but it would absolutely destroy the clip in the process. Slam in a power cell and a spike pierces the battery. The gun uses all of the stuff and then you eject the smoking clip, slamming in another. I think this one would fit our TME game. Instead of 1D10 to everything in a 2m blast radius (pg 199), the gun takes all of the energy for ammo. You now have a limited time to shoot.. My players would be shocked at the gun eating power cells. Both of these methods would be damn hot and you'd probably need some heat protection just to fire it. In 2300AD rpg, once fired, the near molten shells were ejected and you didn't want to be next to the guy firing that. * Most games and sci-fi ignore this part. The Colonial Marines Tech Manual does give it some consideration. To paraphrase: "5 gm pellet.. vaporized by laser into plasma..pushed by magnetic coil to a few km/sec..rides a laser beam that has made an ionized path to the target."
If any of this worked, you'd have a super hot slug of something smacking into a target. If you hit them anywhere, they'd be dead. Similar to explosives in TME, I'd have another lower SV for an secondary strike and damage. Maybe these were made to punch through shell class armors. I don't think they would be super accurate, but it wouldn't matter. Maybe they'd halve armor SV of the target. Maybe it keeps burning for the next round or so..
Of course, someone can say that you just put in a clip and the damn thing fires plasma. That's all you need with TME lasers, right? If that's what a particular game needs and that's all it needs for the story, then more power to ya!
I loved plasma weapons in Fallout 1 & 2. They were like lasers with extreme heat critical effects, melting anything you hit. They just needed energy!
Also, Babylon 5's PPG (Phased Plasma Gun) were a great way to avoid knocking holes in a space station. Unlike Fallout, the B-5 version shot something like ball lightning filled with super hot helium. Longer the range, the more it dissipated. But it did actually use helium for the plasma. The ammo was "caps" that had helium and energy contained in a watch battery sized cell.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- maxstone, thanks for bringing this up. I didn't mean to hijack your post. Whatever is used, I definitely think the range of criticals should be increased as much as the chance for fumbles.
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Post by providence13 on Oct 6, 2013 10:32:48 GMT -8
Double-thumbsup. Plasma weapons were next on my 'to do' list, and these seem to be a great adaptation. I do like the need for tactical (called shot) consideration - very VATS-like. Funnily enough I was also thinking of beam weapons - with a greater level of accuracy afforded over rounds in which the weapon was run, in that the wielder can clearly see where the on-going shot was... I don't know if that might be worth considering...? Hey, clockpunk, wouldn't that work both ways? The more you fire these heavy energy weapons, the more you give away your position. If they have night vision/IR goggles or something, maybe lasers would look like tracer rounds. Just a thought. I imagine lasers with laser targeting. Put a finger on the trigger and you get a dot. Pull the trigger and it fires. One of the reasons for their high SV bonus. |
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Post by maxstone on Oct 6, 2013 15:44:29 GMT -8
Thanks for the good talk guys! And of course Providence, I'm always glad to hear your opinion, so don't be afraid to "hijack" my posts . To Clockpunk: As you can imagine the Fallout targeting system has a special place in my heart and I think the called shots mechanic is pretty similar. The problem stands in the HUGE SV penalty. My players think it's just not worth it ( and I usually agree). Shooting right away works just fine for them. To Providence13: That's right, I just thought that air could be used as "ammo". Can air turn into plasma  ? I've red about a technique called plasma cutting in which air or nitrogen are used to create a plasma "blade". I don't know! If that's possible, only energy would be needed, right? Another interesting point is this: That's quite sure... I first thought that making plasma weapons less effective against humans/deadly against robots would give players a way to strategize more before battles and to finally find a use for the body part chart but with everything you brought to light I think they have to be slower, stronger, and less accurate. PLASMA WEAPONS Version 2 is coming, can you tell me which one you prefer? |
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Post by maxstone on Oct 6, 2013 16:52:14 GMT -8
PLASMA WEAPONS Version 2
PROS: -High damage output -High critical chance (10%) -Can set things on fire (60%) -Bonus damage ( 1 extra d20)to androids, robots and cyborgs-->( cyborgs still require the use of the Table TME--7 Random Body Location, page 106 to determine if the extra damage can be applyed) CONS: -High fumble chance (4%) -Slow rate of fire/ overheating penalty -High energy consumption -Short ranged -inaccurate When these weapons require cool down time, an audio / visual system warns the user. When a critical hit occurs, if it wasn't a called shot, use Table TME--7 Random Body Location to determine what gets melted ( I already love these new toys!). PLASMA PISTOL
Anti robot side gun. Solid and deadly at close range. Found with a foldable side display that highlights and identifies mechanical enemies up to 50m (15% of the times).Runs with pill power cell, 2 years. SV: 0 Rate: 1/2. After 1 shot is fired requires one turn to cool down. If the user keeps firing (rate becomes 1) there's a 90% chance of receiving d20+5 points of damage. If 3 more consecutive shots are fired after the first the gun melts and it's considered destroyed. DMG: 2d20+10 Range: 50m Hands: 1 STR: 18 ammo: power cell/20 shots Weight: 2 kg Value: 1500+d1000 sp PLASMA SHOTGUN
The nightmare of androids and cyborgs. One shot or two of this beast will melt even the toughest bot. SV: +10 Rate: 1/2. After 1 shot is fired requires one turn to cool down. If the user keeps firing (rate becomes 1) there's a 90% chance of receiving d20+10 points of damage. If 3 more consecutive shots are fired after the first the gun melts and it's considered destroyed. DMG: 3d20+10 Range: 20m Hands: 2 STR: 30 ammo: power cell/10 shots Weight: 6,5 kg Value: 2500+d1000 sp PLASMA CARBINE
Most versatile anti robot weapon. Found with special scope that highlights and identifies mechanical enemies up to 200m (15% of the times).Runs with mini power cell, 2 years. SV: +5 Rate: 1/2. After 1 shot is fired requires one turn to cool down. If the user keeps firing (rate becomes 1) there's a 90% chance of receiving d20+10 points of damage. If 3 more consecutive shots are fired after the first the gun melts and it's considered destroyed. DMG: 2d20+15 Range: 90m Hands: 2 STR: 32 ammo: power cell/15 shots Weight: 7.5 kg Value: 3500+d1000 sp I'll test both versions and I'll let you know! Dual wielding plasma pistols all the way to hell!
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Post by providence13 on Oct 7, 2013 9:03:39 GMT -8
I think the called shots mechanic is pretty similar. The problem stands in the HUGE SV penalty. My players think it's just not worth it (and I usually agree). Shooting right away works just fine for them. That's right, I just thought that air could be used as "ammo". Can air turn into plasma ? I've red about a technique called plasma cutting in which air or nitrogen are used to create a plasma "blade".
My players used to agree. Sniper Skill and a few good points in Laser Carbine now make it worth it. The hard part is getting that extra round to aim so the penalties are reduced(pg109). I'm glad the penalty is there; goose/gander. This is not my field. I have done a little research and found the gas is still compressed, while being super-heated. "Range" is practically touching. Not quite weaponized, in my humble opinion. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plasma_cuttingwww.arcadiastreet.com/cgvistas/spacexp/se_leo_1100.htm You could use just air, but you'd still need a lot of energy. Hmmm, radio blackout.. interesting. |
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Post by providence13 on Oct 8, 2013 20:35:59 GMT -8
Maxstone,
Again, your players are lucky to have you.
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Post by providence13 on Oct 9, 2013 6:55:44 GMT -8
Maxstone, I like the 2nd version. The 1st might work for someone else. To each their own and I'd be happy to play in any of your games or any one else's here. When I use them and I will, I might make them require 2 power cells. Just for me, I think increasing the fumble range/shot over your ROF will work vs. just having 90% fail. Yours is probably more realistic; I like the randomness. I also like the min STR for the Plasma shotgun(!), but I might reduce the range. Great job on original content. If only I could type faster.. |
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Post by maxstone on Oct 9, 2013 14:57:45 GMT -8
You're too kind Providence13, thanks a lot! About plasma cutting you're right, it's definitely not a weaponized technique and the generated blade it's very short. One could just assume that a few centuries from now our advanced technology will make it possible. I mean, to have a hand held device capable of generating plasma by sucking, compressing and super heating air from the outside, and then "throwing" it to targets by making it ride a laser beam that has created an ionized path( to quote you).... Sounds absolutely impossible at the moment! But who knows what's in our future! The 2nd version of the weapons looks better, even if really slow compared to the other. Again you're giving me a good idea: why use only one power cell? Let's use a couple! It makes totally sense, plus it makes the cost of every shot higher.Even a shoulder carried power pack, why not. I raised the STR requirement because I thought that the previously described fire mechanism would be bulky and really heavy by default. Who would complain about the weight ? These things let you melt and burn enemies! I'm sure that I'll make many more tweaks before I find a final version to put in my game. At the moment I'm glad about this version though. Extra collateral effet?  |
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clockpunk
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Post by clockpunk on Oct 14, 2013 16:41:54 GMT -8
Ooh, that second batch seems like a good balance.
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Post by maxstone on Oct 24, 2013 14:05:38 GMT -8
Hi guys! I've tested the guns and the second version definitely works better. The problem is that they're a bit too powerful.
The group was exploring a place called Grey Peak. They found out that a large group of raiders had their camp here. Their leader was a huge red mutant, named Konratt. He used one plasma weapon in one hand and had a crab like giant pincer. No one dared engage him in melee for obvious reasons...but maybe that would have been better!! The plasma pistol (ver 2) is a beast! Konratt could fire with rate 1, because of his invulnerability to heat DMG. The group barely made it out alive from that fight. No deaths , just a couple incapacitated PCs.
I'll think about how to tune them!
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)
? I've red about a technique called plasma cutting in which air or nitrogen are used to create a plasma "blade".